Uncensored Money Season Three: Share Investing - It’s More than Downloading an App 

Melissa Browne: Ex-Accountant, Ex-Financial Advisor, Ex-Working Till I Drop, Now Serial Entrepreneur & Author, Financial Wellness Advocate, Living a Life by Design | 06/12/2022


Show Notes

It’s easier and cheaper than ever before to invest in shares. These days we have so many share investing platforms and apps to choose from. However it’s important to choose the right app for you. So in this episode, Mel and Lawsie share 10 things to think about before you download an app and start investing. 

Resources mentioned in this episode: 

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Mel: I remember the first time I invested in shares, I wanted to buy a particular share, and I was such a nervous investor that I used a stockbroker to do it, which obviously cost me more than just using a trading platform, but I didn't know any other way. Now, I appreciate that makes me sound so old, but at least I didn't use to carrier pigeon or hand a stone tablet to a runner to purchase it. So rude. Fast forward to today and it's easier and cheaper than ever before to invest in shares. Plus you have so much choice, not just of platforms or apps, but the type of investments you can use. The problem with all that though, that I see is that there's a lot of access. There's even a lot of knowledge out there that you can have access to. There's just not necessarily a lot of understanding, and that means you might download an app, but it's the wrong one for you long term because it's higher fees or you don't have a holder identifier number, which means you don't own the shares. We had someone inside the My Financial Adulting Plan, who when she got to the investing in shares module, realised that she downloaded the Raiz app which was the old Acorn app back in the day and had been investing. But now she wanted to transfer that, now that she had some understanding of different apps and how she wanted to invest, and she put some more thought into it. She wanted to transfer that to another app and realized she actually couldn't.

So her only choice was sell it and pay the capital gain tax and then use the money to invest in the new app or park it and say, well, that's there.

Lawsie: It is what it is.

Mel: It is what it is. And the problem with Raiz is there's a monthly fee. So she was in that horrible conundrum of, Ugh, I really didn't think this through.

Lawsie: Or she didn't know. Based on what it was at time, like the roundups and all that kind of stuff, which is an awesome way to be able to get your foot in the door and start investing, but yeah she wasn't aware of the sort of longer-term implications with that.

Mel: Exactly, and that's why I really wanted to have this chat today because share investing is more than just downloading an app. So much more. It's as easy as downloading an app. But it's more than downloading an app. So today I want to do a broad stroke today on share investing, following on from my introduction to investing in shares masterclass that I ran last month.

And if you listen to this chat and go, oh my gosh. It's highlighted that I need to know more. I have just thought about downloading an app and starting, maybe I need to put a bit more thought into it. Then go to the show notes and you can still buy the recording if you're interested. And it's 49 bucks, less than a price of a bottle of bougie Champagne. And let's be honest, it's gonna last you a little bit longer than the effects of that. Now, it's not that I wanna put you off investing in shares, far from it, but what Lawsie and I wanna do today is give you a few things to think about before you simply download an app and start.

We're also gonna give you, in the show notes a free download, which compares nine different investing apps. So don't worry about taking notes. If you are thinking about different things, you could head to that download and that can give you a beautiful place to start.

And it will mean that all of the things we're talking about are going to be included in that download as a comparison so that if the particular app you are thinking about isn't in that download, at least you can use it as a starting guide.

So I know we've talked about it here before, Lawsie, but I just wanna before we dive into this, just dispel the myth that women make bad investors.

And there was a fidelity survey done in the US where they surveyed a whole bunch of men and women, and 93% said that men were better investors than women. I hate the whole premise of the survey. I hate that they even did this survey, but 93% of people believed that men were better investors than women, and that's potentially why.

Therefore, women might be abdicating the investment decisions to their blokes because they inherently both believe that. And yet there's been multiple studies, including a Warwick Business School longitudinal study that showed that both men and women outperformed the index. Meaning how the share market as a whole, all of the shares within it, perform over a period of time. But women outperform the men.

Lawsie: Yay.

Mel: Yay. So before we get into it, I really wanted to put all that on the table, cause I know part of the psychology of money that I am so fascinated about is that we bring with us so many inherent beliefs that we are not even aware of that either stop us from making decisions or pause before making a decision or abdicate push the decision to someone else.

So I think it's just being aware of that. And if that's you and if you are someone that's thinking that, then I hope that's made you at least now be able to listen without that filter on.

Lawsie: Definitely. Super important. And I think because, historically for some people if their parents were investing, it may have been a case where it's also the dad that was investing as well. So some people also have that belief of, oh no, that's what dad did, and if you're a female, you might go, oh, therefore my partner will do that, or whatever belief and story and stuff you put around that as well. So it's awesome to know that women can invest and invest better.

Mel: But it's interesting that you say that because it's true. If I think of all the conversations we've had with clients or people in the My Financial Adulting Plan, most of them, their mums didn't invest.

Lawsie: No.

Mel: it was often the dad, I mean it was generally a heterosexual couple if it's a conversation like this.

But generally the mums didn't invest. And that's really curious cause it's often you do what and if you are not seeing that or if you're not having conversations about it. Maybe your mom did invest, you just didn't know cause you didn't talk about money. It's so important to see and know this.

Lawsie: Definitely.

Mel: So now that we are all reframed that in our mind that women are freaking awesome investors.

Lawsie: That we can all invest. Yes.

Mel: The second thing to be super aware of when it comes to downloading an app is we wanna have a long-term timeframe.

Lawsie: Yep.

Mel: So minimum five to seven years. And we do not want our savings for a holiday in there. We do not want our house deposit in there. It needs to really be money that you wanna set and forget or is for that very much a future you.

Lawsie: Yeah, definitely. Cause I think some people go, oh, they start to learn about shares and investing and they see some of the returns that people have had or even look historically and go, oh wow, it's 11% historically, and that's better than even despite the rate rises.

Mel: That will get me a house faster, yeah.

Lawsie: So I think they get tempted to go, oh, cool, I'll put my money for my next European holiday in there, and I'm gonna get my 11%. But it's not quite the case. we've all seen anyone that's been looking at the share markets, in the last six months, 12 months, has seen how much it bounces around which again, the risk is you go, oh, cool, my five grand for my holiday goes in there, but then suddenly your holiday comes around and if the market's dipped and your five grand's only worth four grand clearly you would've been better keeping that money in the bank account, which is why we say you need to have that long term timeframe.

Mel: Yeah. And I think the problem with downloading an app is that often the apps on our phone as are often for that short-term timeframe. It's social media, it's my bank account. It's things that are for that immediate purpose. We don't think of, oh, I'm downloading an app for the long term.

Lawsie: Yeah

Mel: It doesn’t really go so well together. It's a very short-term, immediate thing. So it's just being aware that despite it being via app, we still want that beautiful long-term timeframe.

Lawsie: Oh, definitely. And I think too the apps make it easy, which is a great thing. But I think then some people, you've opened your account. And so you get the emails encouraging you to you’re your first investment. And of course, they want you to make the investment.

They're wanting to make some dollars off you. So people suddenly will go, oh, cool. I've gotta keep feeding that beast in that regard as well, and don't necessarily think about it again with that long-term thing. They're like, oh, I'm doing something good for me. I've got my app and I've started investing, but just haven't thought, why am I investing and what is the purpose of these funds? So just something to be aware of.

Mel: Yeah, definitely. Risk versus rewards, I guess Lawsie we are gonna have like this is a bigger conversation, but it's also being aware that share investing is a risky investment. It's not risky in so far as like it's riskier than cash in the bank. It's riskier than bonds.

So that's why we talk about having that long-term timeframe so that if there are fluctuations in the short term, it's not being concerned about it. But often when you open an app and go into it, you might see things like particularly ones that have very few investments to choose from.

They might call them, here's conservative, here's balanced, here's aggressive, or here is gold, silver, platinum, or however they've decided to call it. Often what they're describing is risk versus rewards, so it's really important to understand. What's your risk profile like? Even if it's an app where you're not investing as much, if that share was to go backwards, how would that make you feel?

And if you think, oh, I would feel sick, I wouldn't sleep, then going for an aggressive option, going for something that will have some bounce around might not be right for you. But it is being aware that what are you investing in? Cause there is volatility and there are ways to manage that volatility through understanding your risk profile and the rewards that will go with it.

And that's something that I spend a bit of time inside the share investing masterclass that I mentioned earlier. Cause I think it's so important to understand that correlation and to also understand your risk profile will change over time as you understand something more. As you develop that muscle, the first time I do weights, it really hurts. By doing it for six months, I feel far more comfortable with this. I've adapted to this and it's the same. But if we think of different asset classes, cash is the safest, then bonds, then property, then shares and shares is considered a high-risk investment. So it is understanding that just because it's an app, it does not mean that it's a hundred per cent safe.

We've seen this. So it's just doing your due diligence, making sure that it is one that you feel comfortable with and even when you're choosing an investment within it, being aware of what it's invested in. And does that correlate to your risk profile?

Lawsie: Yeah, definitely. Most important because generally the riskier it is than the potential for those higher rewards. But again, it's noting that's the potential, not guaranteed. And if you are really nervous around it, that it is looking at options that are gonna be a little bit more conservative, where the risk is lower and your rewards are generally gonna be lower as well. It's like the scales and having to find the right balance between the two, as that's gonna work best for you.

Mel: I love that comment of just because it's high risk doesn't necessarily mean it's high reward. Crypto is the ultimate description of that, right? High risk doesn't necessarily mean it's high reward.

Lawsie: Yep.

Mel: Four is diversification. So we're just talking about different things that we want you to consider before you just download an app and start.

So with some of these apps, you can just choose individual shares. And that might be right for you and for your risk profile and your long-term goals. Your risk profile, long-term goals, diversification, if you go these are things to really have thought of and be mindful of before you download and start.

Because A, you don't wanna put money that you need immediately in. So that's that whole long-term timeframe. But also it's important for you to understand what do I wanna invest in and how can I get diversification? In two weeks time, we're gonna spend a whole podcast episode on diversification, cause I think it's a whole podcast episode worth talking about, but essentially diversification you want it across asset classes, meaning I want to have some cash and bonds and property and shares and maybe some business. I might include some gold or whatever in there. But you also want it within those asset classes. So with property, I don't want it all in the one street, in the one suburb. With shares, I don't want to just go all in on one share. That's not diversification, or I don't even wanna go all in on one industry. So if I download the Spaceship app, I love that I'm holding up my phone to you and no one can see. If you download the Spaceship app, that is US tech shares. There is no diversification in that. And when we saw the tech sector in the US crash this year, or in early 2022, if that was your only investment in the share market, your shares would've been decimated. Whereas if you had US tech shares and some other overseas shares and some blue-chip shares and some small cap shares and blah, blah, blah, then suddenly you are not as at risk.

So diversification's really important. You can get instant diversification by investing in something like an Exchange Traded Fund like the S&P 500, or the ASX 300, or the FTSE 200. Those were all jargon terms to describe investing in the top 500 shares in the US market, the top 300 shares in the Australian, or the top 200 shares in the UK, for example.

As I said, we will unpack this more in the diversification podcast episode, so come play with us there if you wanna know more about that. But what we want you to understand is you wanna make sure that you're not just going all in one share.

Lawsie: Definitely because it's that same thing. That's risky. There’s the potential to be risky because it might be going up and then something happens to that particular business or the industry that business is in and then suddenly it tanks. Whereas if it does tank, but you've got those other investments like you mentioned, they all could continue going up and therefore you're not gonna necessarily feel that same impact if you suddenly get the drop of that one investment, that would be very stressful.

Mel: And again, if you were like, oh gosh, you really lost me, or I wanna know more about that this is so highlighting it, just click down, add to the show notes where that masterclass that I'm investing in shares. 90 minutes with me really diving into this. You get instant access. So go take a look at that.

Lawsie, the next one's fees. This is an important one.

Lawsie: Yeah, definitely. So nothing is free. I shouldn't say nothing. Generally most things are not free. And therefore the cost of doing the investing or increasing your investments and going through an app or a brokerage platform or trading platform or whatever you're doing. Even the cost of buying property, there's always gonna be fees and costs with it. So it's just being aware of what those fees are. And I think sometimes with the apps, people go, oh, it's only a few bucks a month. That's great, but you've gotta take into consideration the amount of money that you're putting in. So say for example, if you were looking at Raiz there depending on what level you're doing with them, but the monthly fees might be $3.50 to $4.50. And ordinarily we go, oh gee, that's, that's cheaper than a latte. But if you're only putting $10 a month into that investment, then suddenly you are spending, potentially 45% of what you are actually putting in, which is huge. Who wants to do that? Who wants to know that the money they're putting in, almost half of that is getting eaten up in fees? So you do need to be aware that even if the fees sound cute and cheap and you go, oh yeah. You've gotta balance that out with the amount that you are investing. I think ASIC in Australia has the guideline around. Let's use ComSec as the obvious bigger trading platform that people use. And I think it's fees roughly 20 bucks or whatever. So ASIC's advice was, if you're gonna be investing then to have that right balance with your fees, you wanna be buying $2,000 worth of whatever investment that you are doing. So it's applying that back cause then when you're looking at some of these apps, they have $9 brokerage fees or $6.50 brokerage fees.

So again, it's going, okay, cool. If it's $6.50 then the recommended thing around there is gonna be investing in lots of $650 or whatever the case may be. So it's just being aware that even if fees may seem cheap, you've gotta look at fees as a percentage of the amount that you are putting in.

And for some people, it's gonna be worth them doing that purely cause it stops 'em spending the money and at least the money gets invested. So you've gotta be aware of who you are and how you are with money when it comes to looking at this, but it's just being aware that fees will eat into anything. And I like, I don't know if people remember the Compare the Pair adds. Industry's super fund ads that, it was always the two health workers that, same age, same jobs, same income, blah, blah, blah. And they're comparing between a higher fees account.

Mel: It was tens of thousands of dollars difference.

Lawsie: Yeah. And the long-term impact of that was huge. So again, it might not seem like little bits now, but it's that whole compounding thing. So the less you can spend on fees versus the amount that you're putting in can have a big impact down the track. That was the rant on fees.

Mel: Love that. There are a couple of apps or one that I'm thinking of. They have moments where they'll have fee free for investing in certain investments. So it's just being really aware of what those are. And I had to check the maths cause you know what I'm like, today was a very early start. Like the ASIC ratio is 1%. So you wanna make sure where you can that the fee is less than 1%.  And if you go to that table we mentioned in the show notes, you'll see what the fees are. But it's being aware that the fees might be five bucks or the fees might be 10 bucks.

But as Lawsie said, if you're only investing a hundred bucks, that's 10% suddenly of your investment. So it's then, okay is that the right app for me or do I save up and put more in? Or as you said, yes, I'm aware that the fee's gonna cost, but I reckon I'll spend that money and better to put it in and not spend it than otherwise.

Lawsie: Yeah.

Mel: Six is ownership Lawsie. This is a big one. And this goes to the example that I talked about above.

Lawsie: Yeah, there are so many different ways to look at ownership, like who should actually own the investments, I think is the first thing. Is it something that you should own? Should it be owned by a different entity? So I think it is very much needing to think about that.

I think, let's be honest, for a lot of people it's probably just quite fine for them to own those investments in their own name and to do those things. But it is being aware that there can be tax considerations and all those kind of things, as well as asset protection and stuff that can come into this.

But if you're just getting into investing, there's nothing wrong with owning it in your own name. And then also when it comes down to that whole ownership piece, it is, do you actually own the shares, or like the examples we mentioned at the start, is it something where you don't actually own the investments?

And so yes, you're investing, but if you want to move and go to a different app or a different platform. You can't go, I'm gonna take my x, Y, Z share or, exchange trader fund or whatever and put it over there cause you don't own it. And so the thing to be aware there is making sure that you've got like a holder identification number and that you own it if you want the option to be able to move and change in the future.

Mel: And you might think it's not important now, but just think about your future self as well. If this is something that you think you'll continue to wanna learn about and grow. If it was me and I was comparing two different apps and they were pretty much of a muchness and one gave me a holder identification number and one didn't, I would go with the holder identification number cause I would want control. I would want the choice. I know strange that I would want the choice to transfer that to something else later if I chose to. Or just say, I found out something about the app, or the app was sold to a company that I felt really uncomfortable with. Again, unless I'm willing to sell it and pay the tax at that time, I'm gonna wanna transfer it away from them.

So there are loads of reasons why you might wanna transfer the investment later. It might be that you're very happy with the investment, but as I said, you are really uncomfortable. with the people that own it, cause it gets sold in the future. So you have more control if you have a holder identification number.

Lawsie: Yeah,

Mel: Which leads us to the next one, which is what's important to you? You can invest in so many different things, in so many different apps. But if things like ethical investing is important, if things like not investing in fossil fuels, if sustainability, it's going and choosing those type of investments and more and more, apps will have an ethical or sustainability, sustainable investment.

But just do your recon around what actually are they investing in. That unethical investment is no tobacco, no mining, no weapons, no fossil fuels, no modern slavery, all this sort of stuff. Or it might just be no fossil fuel investments.

Lawsie: Yeah.

Mel: So it's really important that you figure out what's important to you and then go and do your research around what they're investing in.

If you can't find out or if it's not clear enough, there should always be what's called a Product Disclosure Statement whenever you invest, and it should list the guidelines for the investment and how they invest. If it's not clear, you have every right to contact them and to ask the question.

And if it's ambiguous, if you can't figure it out, then that for me would be a red flag around, well, if you can't figure out how they're investing is that a problem? And there are so many different ones now that are emerging and so many more that we know that are coming.

Cause I think people are gonna demand this more and more. So if it's important to you, be aware, do your research, and actually go and ask the question. Find the Product Disclosure Statement, which is simply a few-page document, and it will say it'll be one of two things.

They'll either say, these are the only type of companies we'll invest in, ie, they have to be sustainable, they have to be this, they have to be that. Or they'll be exclusionary. They'll say, these are the companies we won't invest in. They can't have this. They can't have that. So it's just figuring out which one's the most appropriate and then choosing your investments with that, if that's important to you.

Lawsie: And I think the thing with that is, like you said, it's so subjective. What I think is ethical and sustainable and what am I'm prepared to invest in or not invest in could be very different to you. And so it's just being aware, there are so many different ways that you can invest.

So you need to do that deep dive and not just think, oh, I'm investing ethically cause I've bought this, whatever XYZ ethical fund or whatever. But you do have to know what is important to you and then make sure that aligns with what that particular investment is.

Mel: Yeah, absolutely. So getting to the final three things that we think you need to be aware of when it comes to downloading an app and investing is to be aware there are different ways to invest. We we've touched on a few of these today. ETFs, which are Exchange Traded Funds, managed funds, and individual shares.

I can't think of a single example of an app where you can invest in a managed fund. So if you wanna use an app that's probably out. And a managed fund is where an algorithm or a fund manager invests on your behalf regularly. And it's more that they have an ethos that they'll that they're choosing to invest by.

Yes, there'll be parameters around it, but it's more fluid, I guess is the example. It's fluid investing. Versus an ETF which is more fixed where it's, these are the parameters. They're very clear, they're very succinct. So for example, the top two share 200 shares in this giant share market. I know exactly what I'm getting. It's very clear and therefore it's gonna be cheaper. Cause I'm not relying on anyone's expertise to pick that or individual shares like Commonwealth Bank or Amazon or Tesla. BHP, Telstra, all of those sort of things. So there are many different ways to invest, and it's figuring out what's your risk profile, what's your timeframe, and making sure you have that diversification. And then starting. And in the share investing masterclass, I really go into these three different things, pros and cons of both.

Most people will have a basket of ETFs or a few ETFs, and that will give you the diversification, etc. Others might have some ETFs and a managed fund. Others might have some ETFs and some individual shares, but it's figuring out what's right for you.

Lawsie: Yeah. The thing I would say too, though is don't get caught up with thinking that you are instantly gonna have diversification with an ETF. I think because they're such a popular investment vehicle now you can get thematic or really specific ETFs. Like you mentioned, Spaceship and those are US tech-heavy. It's a very specific investment as opposed to something that's more broad stroke your top 200 shares in the Australian share market or whatever.

So just when you're doing this, make sure that yes, if you decide to go down that road, and same with managed funds. Everything. All of them, you can be really specific with it. It's not gonna guarantee you that diversification. So you wanna still make sure that you've got a broad stroke as well as then you might choose to still use some of your funds to go actually, but I really like that particular thing. Or I'm really knowledgeable in the US tech space, or whatever it is. And you go, I really wanna add that as part of my basket. But yeah, just don't suddenly go, oh, I've got a couple of ETFS. But if they're super specific, you're not necessarily gonna have that broad diversification.

Mel: Yeah, absolutely. The second last one is compounding returns. And if you're following me on Insta at more money for shoes, I'll give example upon example upon example there, cause part of it is encouraging you that even if you've got small amounts, it is absolutely still worth investing those small amounts.

So for example, if I only had a hundred dollars a month to invest, if I invested that over 20 years, at 7% , I'm gonna have $122k. If I had $20 a day. So if I found 20 bucks a day, which doesn't sound like that much over 30 years, at 7% return, three quarters of a million bucks. Like we don't need large amounts.

And too often people tell me they don't have enough to start investing or it's not worth it with a small amount they can afford. I hope that proves that it's absofreakinglutetly worth it. Cause I don't know about you that a hundred bucks a month, I'm not gonna miss it. 20 years at 7%. For anyone listening going, oh, where am I gonna get 7% average share market return over the last 20, was it 30 years? 11.2%. So if 7% is very conservative, 122 grand, I'll take that thanks.

Lawsie: Yeah.

Mel: Versus you're gonna squander a hundred bucks!

Lawsie: It's that small change, which again, some of these apps are great cause it gets people in the habit of starting to put that small amount away and get used to seeing changes in the share market and whatever they've invested in. But it all makes a difference.

So it might feel like this is small and it's not worth anything, but the power of time and can keep building on it, just keep adding those small amounts in. It's just that huge snowball effect where you end up with 122k. That’s easy. For most people, if you look at things, you can go, okay, I can find that 25 bucks a week, I can find it.

Mel: Yeah. Most of us can do that. And even if you can't, if I did one survey a week, if I jumped on and did an online survey or a few online surveys to give me that 25 bucks, then suddenly I don't even have to find my own money.

But the last one is how to make money and how to lose money, and this is where it's really important you lose money when you sell.

So a share market can go backwards. But at that point, if I open my app and my money's gone backwards, it's a paper loss, meaning I actually haven't lost any money unless I sell. So you lose money if the shares go backwards? They absolutely can. And if I sell out at that point, or yes, there are companies that will collapse on the share market. And you'll lose all of your money in it, which is why they're called small-cap shares. If there are shares that are small and risky, that's where we wanna have diversification across a bunch of sectors and across a bunch of different shares. So you can lose money with shares.

But invariably how you lose money is when you cash out when the value of your shares has gone down. How you make money is your share value going up. But again, it's a paper profit. Until you actually sell it that you make money from them going up.

But you also make them from dividends. So dividends are usually paid twice a year. Not all shares pay dividends. Not all ETFs or managed funds pay dividends, but generally there could be blue chip shares where there companies that have existed for a while that have that are making a profit that have decided to release funds to our shareholders, but it doesn't have to.

They don't have to be in existence for a long time. For example, I'm in an ETF that's around sustainability and I received a $500 cheque a couple of weeks ago for my half-yearly dividend. And I went, oh, didn't realize they were paying a dividend. Thanks for coming. So how you can make money through income and capital growth. So the two different ways.

Lawsie: Definitely. And I think the important thing for people is you wanna make sure you're clear on your long-term timeframe. Cause if we go back to the example at the start where it was like, I've got five grand and if it's for your holiday and then you sell, when the market drops and you've at four grand, like you've lost a grand there, like it's a lot of money to lose.

Whereas if you're going, no, that five grand is just so my investing, oh, that sucks that it's dropped a thousand dollars, or 20% or whatever at a point in time, but you just go, Okay. Keep going and doing your thing because it will, or I shouldn't say it will, but the idea is over the long term that it is gonna bounce back and well exceed that five grand that you put in. So that's why you need to, with all of this, you kind of need to take into account all the points that we've said because they all interrelate to be able to help you be successful in your investing and stuff in the long.

Mel: Yeah, absolutely. And final comments. A lot of the questions a lot of the comments or all that we are asked is now a good time to invest. And the answer is Lawsie and my crystal ball doesn't work. We've sent it to the repair shop. We're very disappointed in how its inability to predict the future.

No one has a crystal ball so people can give you their opinion, but there's an old adage, it says time in the market versus timing the market. So it's contributing regularly. Yes, sometimes you're gonna buy high. Yes, sometimes you are gonna buy low. But over time it should wash out so that the average cost will be somewhere in the middle or where it's smoothed out a little bit.

So rather than trying to time it, which even the experts get wildly wrong it's simply saying, I've got a long-term timeframe. It's part of my invest investing goal. I'm just gonna keep going. And if you're buying on the dip, that's better. It's on sale versus, oh, thank goodness shares are going up. I feel good about it, but it's expensive, so it's just, yeah, regularly investing.

Lawsie: Yeah, super important.

Mel: Exactly. So we hope that this has given you the confidence to go and look. If you've already downloaded an app, go and look at it to see is to ask the question, is it still right for you? If you've only just started, it might be that you choose to get out of it perhaps and move it to another one that is more appropriate, or to actually start to think about, okay, great. This gives me great parameters. I'm gonna download the cheatsheet. I might even go and look at the masterclass and it will give me the confidence to not just download and start, but to download, understand, and start.

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